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hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

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episode number 64 for the eighth of

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january two thousand and ten or twenty

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ten no Alice can you say that 10 Oh 2010

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let's just stick with 2010 on this

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week's show we have a presentation given

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in 2005 at the Australian skeptics

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National Convention by loretta marin

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otherwise known as the jelly bean lady

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now her crusade is to rid the world of

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quack products like magnetic underlays

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and so forth using jelly beans as an

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example jelly bean power coming up in a

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few minutes after that a little report

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by dr. rate she and myself as we take a

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stroll down King Street in Newtown a

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suburb here in Sydney and visit a few

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pharmacies along the way that's followed

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by dr. rachy reports where she talks to

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dr. Sheena McGowan about parasites and

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malaria very interesting so sit back

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have a nice glass of yaks milk and enjoy

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breast cancer survivor Loretta Marin is

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a long time crusader against quackery of

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all forms she is best known as the jelly

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bean lady and here in a talk given in

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2005 at the Australian skeptics National

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Convention she discusses how jelly beans

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can often be better than magnetic

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therapy right first of all I show you

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what all this stuff is I i can to come

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to presentations with a truckload of

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things so one thing here is I'm very

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disappointed about this morning where

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we're not allowed to do that multi-level

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marketing because here I have something

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that we can all make a lot of money on

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thats my acupressure jelly bean

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bracelets my jelly bean pain relief

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jewelry and my jelly bean detox pads the

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ones that you stick on your feet and

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overnight sucks out all the toxins and

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there's also the jelly bean herbal tea

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in it generally is it heard because it

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comes from sugar herbs come from plum

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and this is my other one which i think

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is really good this is my multi

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homeopathic remedy it may cure every

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disease and health condition and in

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there it's got vital force and memory of

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the remedy and you all watched second

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opinion so you do understand homeopathic

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remedies in that it's about the memory

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of what you've put in there now we do

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have some good medication here that

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really doesn't have too many side

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effects I put the pills there and this

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is the placebo pills the famous placebo

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pills proven should be thirty percent

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effective ensuring everything proven by

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thousands of clinical trials all over

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the world so that's one thing that I do

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is I haven't found any side effects on

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it yet in fact it's actually good for

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diabetics and people giving up smoking

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because they go hypoglycemic and I

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believe there's some new pace that you

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put on your ulcers that's got some

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glucose base but that's medical and

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that's not my area but anything to do

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with that term jelly beans i'm

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interested

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in a guy so that when he makes bit he

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puts a jack a black jellybeans and it

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stops all the the GU going unit so jelly

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beans are very very handy sorts of

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things to have now I've got some

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booklets here did you all get one oh

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good because there's plenty left if

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anybody wants some more and you would

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have probably noticed in the centerfold

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Geraldine's a centerfold girl as much

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information as I could put in about this

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particular adverse events I've got the

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iridology chart there so if anybody has

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any problems later on I can certainly

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help Oh wrong one when this came out

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they had an invented electricity so I

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think they must have done it by this and

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compliments of Geraldine now there's

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only one person in the world like an

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email and say hello Geraldine do you

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have an eyeball and she said yes I've

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got an eyeball a kidney and a heart and

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she gave them to me for my presentations

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as well over here is my homie who's open

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that there's a snake and the spider

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missing now calm down they're natural so

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they say as anybody just quite look

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around as anybody got all right wretches

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over there come on Rex Rex come on just

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just throwing these are good he's a good

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catch I'm finally now the Cobra and

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come on sweetheart now these are genuine

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go ahead the anthrax we've got the air

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tracks i think but he would keep

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stealing that I've got no idea why it's

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all natural perfectly safe and the

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citric acid in the mercury and the

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caffeine caffeine and there's the

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million dollars still there James

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Randy's million dollars for anyone

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homeopathic remedy that can be proven

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I've offered that money to a lot of

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people and they've never taken me up on

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it now before I came I had trouble

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sleeping so i took my homeopathic remedy

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for flipping which is one drop of

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caffeine in a swimming pool and for

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those of you that don't know homeopathy

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it's one drop in now i did this last

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time and i had to go round the board

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twice now honestly you know those kids

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with critical thinking do you really

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think that one drop in that many will

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have any effect at all homeopathy don't

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knock unless you try it and I thought

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they can can't possibly be real huh so

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I've written on here 300,000 homeopaths

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and 40 homeopathic university

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universities can't be wrong so therefore

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homeopathy must work if I do that for

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presentations for seniors I have a lot

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of fun doing it I've also had a lot of

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very negative feedback from the people

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that like their natural therapy and let

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me actually quite abusive live even step

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made some fairly personal statements

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about me as well which I thought was

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quite good because I will use it all for

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writing articles and though the first

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one I'd like to talk about is how I

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became the power of one in situations

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whereby somebody famous gets an illness

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we talk christopher region is broken

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back Michael J Fox what they do is they

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suddenly champion the cause of that

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illness and it's fantastic that they do

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that because they use their life skills

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and their position to raise awareness

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and raise money for research how good is

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that my favorite is Lance Armstrong now

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he rides a bicycle for you ladies that

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don't follow the Tour de France not an

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exercise bicycle a proper one in 1996

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this guy was rated number one in the

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world as a cyclist you know with a

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little cute bendix outfit big thick

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thighs any rat dog skinny though these

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guys anyway he was diagnosed with cancer

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1996 he was given a twenty percent

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chance of surviving he had really

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radical chemotherapy all that kind of

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stuff and he decided he wasn't going to

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die he was going to do everything he

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could and for those of you that watch

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the Tour de France he won it for the

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just a couple of weeks here I thought

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where that guy is inspirational and he's

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doing so much to raise awareness for

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these things too sometimes it takes some

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really negative event before we'll go

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out and a lemon follow a passion that we

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have to try to make some changes the

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fact that you're keen to this conference

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suggests to me that perhaps there isn't

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a perfect world it and you've all got

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some agenda that you want would like to

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see changed I say with creationist when

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they work I had to get the three fast

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and bloody dinosaurs on the Ark's I'm

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third every day in Australia 30 women

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are diagnosed with cancer breast cancer

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five died unfortunately first of october

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two thousand three i was one of those

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women i'm sitting there with the

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perfectly straight face doctors telling

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me about these horrific things that

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could happen to me no cutting and

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cutting and burning and drugs and I just

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couldn't believe I'm a digital I'm fine

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I feel fantastic now the only reason I'm

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going to live to be a hundred is because

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of Orthodox mentor because they got me

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early bit of a snip bit of a burn and a

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lot of help to make sure that I'm going

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to be one of the survivors when I had

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for those of you that have been touched

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with cancer most of you would have might

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be a neighbor friend family member even

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yourselves or some gentlemen here before

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you know that the treatment is very long

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for me it was four months from my

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diagnosis to the last treatment the last

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eight weeks was driving a to our return

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trip into brisbane for like twenty

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second radiotherapy treatment and during

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those times sometimes the machine would

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be down and I'd be an hour or two in the

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waiting room I talked to the other

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patients back sometimes I had to talk to

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them through a voice books these were

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wonderful people you know mothers with

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little children there they're all going

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through the same horrific events that i

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was and i know that a lot of them won't

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be here now they'll be dead or they'll

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be dead soon some of them were really at

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the end you know being wheeled in an

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hour if i can achieve anything through

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getting my cancer through the Sun that

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I'm having with people like yourself I

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will dedicate it to those people because

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they sure didn't deserve what they're

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getting wonderful people Nationals

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seniors Association is anybody a member

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of national seniors Association like all

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after the eight weeks you know too young

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not too young to get a bargain after the

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eight weeks of going in and out one day

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it was suddenly over and I woke up the

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next day and I was really a bit of a

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zombie so you're just there your whole

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life suddenly was planning oh we got to

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get there by 11 every day is a different

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time I'm going to get there by eleven

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o'clock today that's it that was your

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whole day taken over and recovering and

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at the end of it you burnt you totally

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met all these amazing people you

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sometimes really angry I was sometimes

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really anxious sad shocked all these

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things it was a rollercoaster trip for

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me and really your memories gone you

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can't remember names you talk about that

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bloke with the colorful shirt in the

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front row that he got from salvation

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army data you end up great long

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sentences and they fell for it or Peter

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or this for that and you can't believe

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where's my memory God that most of us

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come back but I talked to my GP who is

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over there who name is here being

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fantastic to work with her on the

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website and I said what's wrong with me

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she said you've got traumatic stress and

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I thought well she's right that's a

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trauma you know and so I understand now

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that what I was going through was quite

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a normal thing to happen national scene

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is Association 300,000 members round

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Australia the most vulnerable people on

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the planet they're over 50s what do they

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do view about 10 years ago I went back

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to union i did basic psychology

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advertising English just because i

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thought i would like to learn about

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those things so really all that means as

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i know i've got the books but i know i'm

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good at looking things up i could read

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ads so I open the book page after page

272
00:13:25,929 --> 00:13:23,089
herbal remedy for sex for you know for

273
00:13:29,230 --> 00:13:25,939
knees for joints all famous page and

274
00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:29,240
page and then page after page of miracle

275
00:13:33,670 --> 00:13:31,730
cure for cancer by this net repair for

276
00:13:35,079 --> 00:13:33,680
this cancer for that and then products

277
00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:35,089
that clearly defied physics and

278
00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:37,689
physiology I saw this this isn't right

279
00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:40,970
so I email the food and drugs

280
00:13:46,509 --> 00:13:43,490
illustration about one product and I

281
00:13:47,949 --> 00:13:46,519
started researching stuff compile the

282
00:13:49,929 --> 00:13:47,959
great little lesson you know saying that

283
00:13:52,540 --> 00:13:49,939
these things that this is the proof this

284
00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:52,550
is the information sent it into them and

285
00:13:58,990 --> 00:13:55,490
of course what did they do yeah yeah

286
00:14:01,170 --> 00:13:59,000
nothing and at that time I went to my

287
00:14:03,910 --> 00:14:01,180
oncologist I had a meeting with her and

288
00:14:05,829 --> 00:14:03,920
she said what are you doing Loretta and

289
00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:05,839
I said you know I said I'm trying to

290
00:14:11,379 --> 00:14:08,930
fight yeah like a probably 20 billion

291
00:14:13,179 --> 00:14:11,389
dollar industry on my own and I said

292
00:14:16,210 --> 00:14:13,189
it's get me down a bit I'm just feeling

293
00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:16,220
a bit fragile I think I'm going to give

294
00:14:21,460 --> 00:14:19,370
up she said don't give up Loretta you'd

295
00:14:24,610 --> 00:14:21,470
be surprised how much power one person

296
00:14:26,860 --> 00:14:24,620
has so I went home turn on the computer

297
00:14:30,460 --> 00:14:26,870
and I read you just a little bit of this

298
00:14:33,850 --> 00:14:30,470
because I was really angry and I thought

299
00:14:37,569 --> 00:14:33,860
right I just started off very festively

300
00:14:39,429 --> 00:14:37,579
as I am we I demand you apologize to all

301
00:14:41,170 --> 00:14:39,439
your members and this is a couple of

302
00:14:43,900 --> 00:14:41,180
things not only do you print ads for

303
00:14:45,549 --> 00:14:43,910
cracks natural pest quackery pulls the

304
00:14:47,679 --> 00:14:45,559
sex and weight loss and the possibility

305
00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:47,689
of some pesticide thrown in for good

306
00:14:51,340 --> 00:14:49,850
measure and banned products but your

307
00:14:53,379 --> 00:14:51,350
policies even prevent quality

308
00:14:56,439 --> 00:14:53,389
information being made available to your

309
00:14:58,059 --> 00:14:56,449
computer literate readers and I had

310
00:15:00,220 --> 00:14:58,069
asked the computer section to put in our

311
00:15:02,650 --> 00:15:00,230
timers and tinnitus links for some new

312
00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:02,660
revolution II and they said throw this

313
00:15:07,799 --> 00:15:04,610
is for fun I'm not a lot of health stuff

314
00:15:09,939 --> 00:15:07,809
in and this guy was a retired pharmacist

315
00:15:11,710 --> 00:15:09,949
and I ended it I think you should

316
00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:11,720
apologize your membership for their lost

317
00:15:15,309 --> 00:15:13,730
opportunities to give them advice and

318
00:15:17,319 --> 00:15:15,319
hope for their quality of life now and

319
00:15:19,269 --> 00:15:17,329
in the future and for the total lack of

320
00:15:21,009 --> 00:15:19,279
understanding in peddling snake oil

321
00:15:22,869 --> 00:15:21,019
products and services and I went and

322
00:15:24,939 --> 00:15:22,879
packed every email in that bloody

323
00:15:28,629 --> 00:15:24,949
newspaper and fax it off to the mouth

324
00:15:32,259 --> 00:15:28,639
all that I've done all I cared anyway I

325
00:15:34,090 --> 00:15:32,269
got back to me they said Loretta could

326
00:15:38,259 --> 00:15:34,100
you put an unemotional argument to the

327
00:15:39,999 --> 00:15:38,269
editor so I penetrable wait in fact I've

328
00:15:41,829 --> 00:15:40,009
ticked away pretty well up until last

329
00:15:43,389 --> 00:15:41,839
week away from the email wrote a nice

330
00:15:46,059 --> 00:15:43,399
letter that just give me a couple of

331
00:15:49,540 --> 00:15:46,069
weeks to put my argument together and my

332
00:15:51,639 --> 00:15:49,550
argument was that a lot of people over

333
00:15:54,189 --> 00:15:51,649
50 the only non financial magazine they

334
00:15:54,540 --> 00:15:54,199
get is the National seniors Association

335
00:15:56,310 --> 00:15:54,550
one

336
00:15:58,829 --> 00:15:56,320
that's all I get and they can't afford

337
00:16:01,290 --> 00:15:58,839
the six dollars for women's weekly the

338
00:16:03,630 --> 00:16:01,300
other one is that unfortunately over the

339
00:16:05,519 --> 00:16:03,640
people over fifty fifty percent of them

340
00:16:07,620 --> 00:16:05,529
have clinical evidence of Alzheimer

341
00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:07,630
that's not too bad and they've all got a

342
00:16:11,430 --> 00:16:09,250
bit of a memory problem there and all

343
00:16:13,199 --> 00:16:11,440
these things I linked to websites I'm

344
00:16:14,460 --> 00:16:13,209
also only two percent of people are

345
00:16:16,500 --> 00:16:14,470
going to have enough money to retire oh

346
00:16:21,210 --> 00:16:16,510
and I went on with all the facts and

347
00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:21,220
figures and i'm pleased to say that the

348
00:16:26,220 --> 00:16:23,410
dodgy health products are gone the

349
00:16:27,420 --> 00:16:26,230
naturopaths are gone some of the pools

350
00:16:30,300 --> 00:16:27,430
are still there but there were only two

351
00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:30,310
pages on it so one person can make a

352
00:16:40,050 --> 00:16:38,519
I'd rather get a big gun know about this

353
00:16:42,259 --> 00:16:40,060
because you know Geraldine I've got

354
00:16:45,090 --> 00:16:42,269
something to boast to that gives a damn

355
00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:45,100
the local new page that had the detox

356
00:16:49,139 --> 00:16:47,170
pads you know not not the proper ones

357
00:16:50,430 --> 00:16:49,149
but those artificial one said you know

358
00:16:53,340 --> 00:16:50,440
they put out the front of the net

359
00:16:56,340 --> 00:16:53,350
repairs places and so I attached a

360
00:17:00,060 --> 00:16:56,350
triple c letter that said the a trip

361
00:17:01,949 --> 00:17:00,070
will see is seeking to keeping an eye on

362
00:17:04,049 --> 00:17:01,959
the media that's exploiting the

363
00:17:06,659 --> 00:17:04,059
vulnerable and that's why i always put

364
00:17:09,270 --> 00:17:06,669
senior on everything because seniors I

365
00:17:13,710 --> 00:17:09,280
seem to be vulnerable whereas adults out

366
00:17:14,939 --> 00:17:13,720
for some reason so I tell people seniors

367
00:17:16,290 --> 00:17:14,949
you know if it's not to achieve

368
00:17:18,740 --> 00:17:16,300
grandmother but everything I've written

369
00:17:21,150 --> 00:17:18,750
is for anybody else anyways complaint

370
00:17:23,069 --> 00:17:21,160
and he wrote back thank you for bringing

371
00:17:25,290 --> 00:17:23,079
the advertisement to our attention we

372
00:17:27,090 --> 00:17:25,300
will certainly not be accepting any

373
00:17:33,030 --> 00:17:27,100
further advertising from this particular

374
00:17:35,730 --> 00:17:33,040
person I thought you champion one person

375
00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:35,740
can make a difference now the thing

376
00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:38,110
about teams right just don't like to

377
00:17:42,120 --> 00:17:40,090
mention the team business but the

378
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:42,130
skeptics have a reputation that the

379
00:17:46,950 --> 00:17:44,770
world's worst team people there's three

380
00:17:48,750 --> 00:17:46,960
thousand of you all doing three thousand

381
00:17:50,490 --> 00:17:48,760
different things and no one wants to

382
00:17:53,730 --> 00:17:50,500
help the guy on the left or the right

383
00:17:55,820 --> 00:17:53,740
and it the skeptics will readily admit

384
00:17:58,470 --> 00:17:55,830
that but I want to put this on record

385
00:18:00,360 --> 00:17:58,480
that's from the first day of my journey

386
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:00,370
where I'm wobbling along on my bike with

387
00:18:05,640 --> 00:18:02,650
the training wheels Barry was there

388
00:18:06,820 --> 00:18:05,650
hanging on the back giving me advice and

389
00:18:09,759 --> 00:18:06,830
guidance in the tea

390
00:18:12,100 --> 00:18:09,769
were there pushing me along and then

391
00:18:14,500 --> 00:18:12,110
when finally I was going good it's not

392
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:14,510
bad they were cheering and clapping and

393
00:18:18,070 --> 00:18:16,610
telling me to go I could not have I

394
00:18:20,380 --> 00:18:18,080
would not have had the self-confidence

395
00:18:22,570 --> 00:18:20,390
to do what I have done today if it

396
00:18:26,380 --> 00:18:22,580
wasn't for Barry dr. Richard Gordon

397
00:18:29,769 --> 00:18:26,390
Richard Saunders Geraldine Moses Bob

398
00:18:31,330 --> 00:18:29,779
Bruce lily and Derek Laurie Eddie and if

399
00:18:34,870 --> 00:18:31,340
you have quite a few others i don't even

400
00:18:37,870 --> 00:18:34,880
know who took the time to email me or to

401
00:18:39,070 --> 00:18:37,880
complain about something else the one

402
00:18:42,190 --> 00:18:39,080
thing about complaining i will mention

403
00:18:46,180 --> 00:18:42,200
women love complaining going girls

404
00:18:48,970 --> 00:18:46,190
complaining or right and that's how I

405
00:18:52,090 --> 00:18:48,980
got the name the power of one if me and

406
00:18:54,610 --> 00:18:52,100
a tiny team can achieve so much just

407
00:18:56,799 --> 00:18:54,620
imagine how much we could do if a few

408
00:18:59,680 --> 00:18:56,809
more of you got on and just in anything

409
00:19:04,899 --> 00:18:59,690
even positive thoughts will help and

410
00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:04,909
that's why I put this out now curious if

411
00:19:08,980 --> 00:19:07,250
I put that one this was the photo taken

412
00:19:12,190 --> 00:19:08,990
now what have I achieved ok apart from

413
00:19:15,669 --> 00:19:12,200
that I will shortly be featured in new

414
00:19:17,289 --> 00:19:15,679
idea I'm not sure when and they took a

415
00:19:18,639 --> 00:19:17,299
bit of all these photos on me this is

416
00:19:21,190 --> 00:19:18,649
the best one I thought to the last photo

417
00:19:24,250 --> 00:19:21,200
ever want taken I look quite good in it

418
00:19:26,980 --> 00:19:24,260
and I thought what can I do can i

419
00:19:30,100 --> 00:19:26,990
approach new idea about putting in

420
00:19:33,070 --> 00:19:30,110
something in gb places in surgeries to

421
00:19:34,539 --> 00:19:33,080
let patients do their own research the

422
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:34,549
one thing i am good at is being a

423
00:19:42,279 --> 00:19:38,570
patient other thing too Australian

424
00:19:46,930 --> 00:19:42,289
doctor now holy GPS get australian GP CA

425
00:19:56,750 --> 00:19:46,940
and dr. jun 17 check your copy the very

426
00:20:01,590 --> 00:19:59,430
and that comes from nagging McCracken

427
00:20:05,279 --> 00:20:01,600
emailing people but unnecessarily about

428
00:20:08,450 --> 00:20:05,289
the skills that I have now it just have

429
00:20:12,150 --> 00:20:08,460
a quick story about the magnetic story

430
00:20:14,430 --> 00:20:12,160
Geraldine as I say I keep t6 in my life

431
00:20:17,970 --> 00:20:14,440
and attend different places I first got

432
00:20:19,529 --> 00:20:17,980
to know when they did the booklet and I

433
00:20:22,169 --> 00:20:19,539
thought I was so smart I thought all

434
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:22,179
right a booklet I chose you i think i

435
00:20:27,870 --> 00:20:24,730
was on the drugs in or something and I

436
00:20:31,140 --> 00:20:27,880
thought I've got to adverse events look

437
00:20:33,570 --> 00:20:31,150
as a person you can talk to a person I

438
00:20:36,360 --> 00:20:33,580
bad drugs awesome how good is that a

439
00:20:38,490 --> 00:20:36,370
person and I so good it contact us I

440
00:20:40,140 --> 00:20:38,500
thought there's a line it's in Brisbane

441
00:20:43,740 --> 00:20:40,150
you can actually bring somebody up

442
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:43,750
that's a fantastic anyway so I thought

443
00:20:49,049 --> 00:20:46,450
I'll ask permission and you can see it's

444
00:20:51,690 --> 00:20:49,059
in why it's so important to me talk to a

445
00:20:53,940 --> 00:20:51,700
person so I did so I got on to someone

446
00:20:55,590 --> 00:20:53,950
they said I said can I use the adverse

447
00:20:58,430 --> 00:20:55,600
event stuff you love to talk to

448
00:21:01,110 --> 00:20:58,440
Geraldine Moses that woman on the radio

449
00:21:03,180 --> 00:21:01,120
so I ringing up Geraldine and I say you

450
00:21:04,950 --> 00:21:03,190
know trying to sound like I'm spooked a

451
00:21:08,310 --> 00:21:04,960
bit she says what's the objective of you

452
00:21:10,770 --> 00:21:08,320
booklet Oh to help seniors get in make

453
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:10,780
informed choices on Orthodox and

454
00:21:14,850 --> 00:21:12,970
complementary and alternative I thought

455
00:21:18,210 --> 00:21:14,860
Stan freeze that she said what do you

456
00:21:19,500 --> 00:21:18,220
know about cam I said nothing I said I

457
00:21:22,980 --> 00:21:19,510
direct the mall to the skeptics

458
00:21:26,010 --> 00:21:22,990
dictionary 64 million dollar answer

459
00:21:27,450 --> 00:21:26,020
after that Geraldine couldn't do enough

460
00:21:29,070 --> 00:21:27,460
to help the woman is right in the

461
00:21:31,590 --> 00:21:29,080
Fleming thesis she's got a one year old

462
00:21:34,770 --> 00:21:31,600
kid she takes a booklet I'm very black

463
00:21:37,260 --> 00:21:34,780
and white she softened it fixed it she

464
00:21:40,950 --> 00:21:37,270
hasn't got rid of me since we're still

465
00:21:43,140 --> 00:21:40,960
doing juro right and that was her and I

466
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:43,150
thank you for doing that and even all

467
00:21:47,010 --> 00:21:45,490
right the magnetic therapy I tell

468
00:21:48,919 --> 00:21:47,020
Geraldine should know me at a party I'm

469
00:21:51,570 --> 00:21:48,929
wandering around after people's magnets

470
00:21:58,169 --> 00:21:51,580
and this is the wonderful device itself

471
00:22:00,330 --> 00:21:58,179
who my beloved gas meter people have

472
00:22:02,490 --> 00:22:00,340
admitted even my friends right the best

473
00:22:03,940 --> 00:22:02,500
thing with my friends when I decided I

474
00:22:07,419 --> 00:22:03,950
was going to prove make

475
00:22:09,759 --> 00:22:07,429
character with they said to me

476
00:22:12,970 --> 00:22:09,769
after several attempts to show them as i

477
00:22:14,590 --> 00:22:12,980
mentioned in my articles they said all

478
00:22:16,299 --> 00:22:14,600
right Loretta we believe you and I leave

479
00:22:18,370 --> 00:22:16,309
your bloody magnets at home and i

480
00:22:21,730 --> 00:22:18,380
thought no i never did but that was

481
00:22:24,070 --> 00:22:21,740
enough from my friends to prove that it

482
00:22:28,509 --> 00:22:24,080
I could show them that they were being

483
00:22:31,810 --> 00:22:28,519
defrauded that the jellybean under life

484
00:22:34,029 --> 00:22:31,820
I prepared these for Gerald to show

485
00:22:36,100 --> 00:22:34,039
Geraldine but they weren't like this

486
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:36,110
there are two raggy bits of material

487
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:38,690
stapled together and I had them ready to

488
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:41,330
show up on the day will mention this

489
00:22:46,210 --> 00:22:43,970
went with the first recorded ESP ever in

490
00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:46,220
history Geraldine 12 months before it

491
00:22:52,570 --> 00:22:49,010
give me a phone number and I had worked

492
00:22:54,250 --> 00:22:52,580
in public service i fathered one day my

493
00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:54,260
phone was out a week and I'd tell gel

494
00:22:57,879 --> 00:22:56,690
deny was going to drop in that day so I

495
00:22:59,620 --> 00:22:57,889
think the conversation went something

496
00:23:02,950 --> 00:22:59,630
like that and I had these to show her

497
00:23:05,710 --> 00:23:02,960
and I said ring ring hello Geraldine

498
00:23:07,629 --> 00:23:05,720
it's Loretta what are you ringing me as

499
00:23:09,490 --> 00:23:07,639
he hears something noon you got me

500
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:09,500
ringing meet the farming year I said no

501
00:23:20,190 --> 00:23:11,210
I'm we were no offense Martin I said

502
00:23:26,740 --> 00:23:23,769
sure this is I said to tell you I can't

503
00:23:29,590 --> 00:23:26,750
make it to where I'm at the University

504
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:29,600
and I said why are you ringing media she

505
00:23:34,330 --> 00:23:32,450
said Britain extra what you on and she

506
00:23:36,399 --> 00:23:34,340
said what to do it I said I would walk

507
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:36,409
on broken glass to do that presentation

508
00:23:42,730 --> 00:23:38,690
and she said well that sounds okay all

509
00:23:45,279 --> 00:23:42,740
right anyway so I managed in this next

510
00:23:47,409 --> 00:23:45,289
few days to delay them so I could look

511
00:23:50,620 --> 00:23:47,419
like I knew what I was doing I'm Irish

512
00:23:54,279 --> 00:23:50,630
run I had the jar I had the jellybeans

513
00:23:57,250 --> 00:23:54,289
and alone and Australian jellybean

514
00:23:59,320 --> 00:23:57,260
handle a and there's the real one

515
00:24:01,269 --> 00:23:59,330
there's a jellybean one I hide them and

516
00:24:03,190 --> 00:24:01,279
I do demos and for some reason everybody

517
00:24:06,190 --> 00:24:03,200
has always picked the jelly bean I'm

518
00:24:07,779 --> 00:24:06,200
delay in my surgeon thing that one I saw

519
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:07,789
the needle flickr that one and I don't

520
00:24:13,149 --> 00:24:11,330
know I oh sorry and the and they

521
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:13,159
actually better because if stood out

522
00:24:18,030 --> 00:24:15,250
what you can eat them huh

523
00:24:19,620 --> 00:24:18,040
and they have no side effects so that as

524
00:24:21,060 --> 00:24:19,630
I say was an emergency rest of my

525
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:21,070
girlfriend's hair so she could throw up

526
00:24:26,970 --> 00:24:25,330
these for the presentation later on not

527
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:26,980
too much later on i'll be showing the

528
00:24:33,300 --> 00:24:29,250
video and we can go through that widget

529
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:33,310
we've got time for that yes now dr. Lisa

530
00:24:37,290 --> 00:24:35,530
laakso is over here she features she's

531
00:24:38,970 --> 00:24:37,300
the good-looking one in the video and

532
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:38,980
this is the nose we'll be looking up in

533
00:24:57,660 --> 00:24:54,730
a minute so here yes no volume family is

534
00:24:58,980 --> 00:24:57,670
magnetic therapy Lisa honey balls be

535
00:25:01,310 --> 00:24:58,990
looking at the products that are

536
00:25:03,510 --> 00:25:01,320
available and whether they do work

537
00:25:05,580 --> 00:25:03,520
magnetic therapy there are the young

538
00:25:07,380 --> 00:25:05,590
delays I said when you're receiving the

539
00:25:10,140 --> 00:25:07,390
benefits every single night the spa

540
00:25:12,030 --> 00:25:10,150
treatments the isolating particular

541
00:25:14,970 --> 00:25:12,040
point very whether it's a neat wrist

542
00:25:18,060 --> 00:25:14,980
elbow ankle the faithful you to feel so

543
00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:18,070
much better haiyan go and the nuggets

544
00:25:22,230 --> 00:25:20,770
people are not being told the truth for

545
00:25:25,230 --> 00:25:22,240
years there's been a hard sell on

546
00:25:27,300 --> 00:25:25,240
magnets to treat pain crane Trinder says

547
00:25:29,790 --> 00:25:27,310
he brought the therapy to Australia a

548
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:29,800
formal own of ivory so he says he broke

549
00:25:35,700 --> 00:25:33,010
30 bones and her back and speak ears on

550
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:35,710
drugs before trying magnets in the US

551
00:25:40,310 --> 00:25:38,050
not three days and I was the difference

552
00:25:43,290 --> 00:25:40,320
in the pain relief and then after about

553
00:25:46,650 --> 00:25:43,300
15 days Toby Hall is just incredible

554
00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:46,660
Frances he sold 300,000 products in

555
00:25:50,940 --> 00:25:48,460
starting gold coast-based company

556
00:25:53,090 --> 00:25:50,950
biomagnetic and he happily presents

557
00:25:56,490 --> 00:25:53,100
customers who saved that would be works

558
00:25:59,040 --> 00:25:56,500
carpal tunnel and it kept me away from

559
00:26:01,680 --> 00:25:59,050
not prevented me from using my hands and

560
00:26:02,460 --> 00:26:01,690
within two weeks I was feeling right

561
00:26:04,620 --> 00:26:02,470
from a knife

562
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:04,630
move in six weeks I was able to get up

563
00:26:11,909 --> 00:26:08,530
up up out of bed and move around I was a

564
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:11,919
16 year old go fix don't fire or lose

565
00:26:17,460 --> 00:26:14,490
any fertile statements are not evidence

566
00:26:20,100 --> 00:26:17,470
the red American calls herself the jelly

567
00:26:24,950 --> 00:26:20,110
bean lately she's on a campaign to prove

568
00:26:30,899 --> 00:26:28,890
many mothers with small children who

569
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:30,909
have boxful bruises you give them a

570
00:26:35,460 --> 00:26:33,490
jelly bean they're instantly chilled and

571
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:35,470
that's just a placebo of it and the

572
00:26:40,140 --> 00:26:37,690
placebo effect is what Loretta believes

573
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:40,150
is at play when people find magnetic

574
00:26:45,090 --> 00:26:42,850
therapy working she says many consumers

575
00:26:47,159 --> 00:26:45,100
get no benefit but you don't hear them

576
00:26:49,289 --> 00:26:47,169
number of people that I know that are

577
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:49,299
bought some of these magnetic products

578
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:51,250
they have put them in their cupboards

579
00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:54,250
and put them on a braided my Loretta so

580
00:26:59,039 --> 00:26:56,490
passionate well she had breast cancer

581
00:27:01,350 --> 00:26:59,049
prompting her to investigate treatments

582
00:27:03,690 --> 00:27:01,360
for chronic illnesses she has a maths

583
00:27:05,970 --> 00:27:03,700
and physics degree so she looks for

584
00:27:08,789 --> 00:27:05,980
evidence which she says is severely

585
00:27:11,130 --> 00:27:08,799
lacking when it comes to magnets the

586
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:11,140
people I represent the cancer patients

587
00:27:17,220 --> 00:27:13,570
and seniors and they really don't have

588
00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:17,230
the money to be buying recibo product so

589
00:27:21,659 --> 00:27:19,150
where does all this leave the people in

590
00:27:23,730 --> 00:27:21,669
the middle consumers salespeople one

591
00:27:26,010 --> 00:27:23,740
science sceptics of the other can be

592
00:27:28,529 --> 00:27:26,020
tough making an informed decision well

593
00:27:30,990 --> 00:27:28,539
science is trying to give us conclusive

594
00:27:33,510 --> 00:27:31,000
answers well we've always be a lot of

595
00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:33,520
investment in my own money in it it will

596
00:27:38,010 --> 00:27:35,650
do seem to suggest that it helps them so

597
00:27:39,779 --> 00:27:38,020
we need to find out whether in Baptism

598
00:27:42,419 --> 00:27:39,789
and how it does it in a griffith

599
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:42,429
university studies strong flux magnets

600
00:27:46,940 --> 00:27:44,650
are being placed directly on the skin of

601
00:27:49,500 --> 00:27:46,950
people with tennis elbow pain

602
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:49,510
indications are the perhaps there wasn't

603
00:27:53,970 --> 00:27:52,090
a bit perhaps that effect is not a nerve

604
00:27:55,799 --> 00:27:53,980
based response perhaps there's something

605
00:27:59,630 --> 00:27:55,809
else that's happening and that's what we

606
00:28:01,310 --> 00:27:59,640
have to go on to test so far only a hand

607
00:28:03,950 --> 00:28:01,320
what patients have been studied and

608
00:28:06,650 --> 00:28:03,960
researchers admit measuring pain levels

609
00:28:08,510 --> 00:28:06,660
scientifically is proving tough pretty

610
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:08,520
frustrating because I'm not sure at this

611
00:28:12,650 --> 00:28:10,050
point in time that we have a technology

612
00:28:14,870 --> 00:28:12,660
actually your wife xserve are actually

613
00:28:17,060 --> 00:28:14,880
occurring as they persevere the

614
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:17,070
Australian consumers association says

615
00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:19,050
it's found no conclusive scientific

616
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:22,050
evidence to support magnets but nothing

617
00:28:27,020 --> 00:28:24,450
either to say they're harmful except

618
00:28:28,820 --> 00:28:27,030
maybe to the hip pocket these underlays

619
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:28,830
sell for two hundred and ninety-nine

620
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:31,530
dollars for a queen made Craig started

621
00:28:35,990 --> 00:28:33,450
out offering money back guarantees but

622
00:28:37,940 --> 00:28:36,000
doesn't now though studies on I can

623
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:37,950
comment on it the Consumers Association

624
00:28:42,620 --> 00:28:40,530
advises people try and magnetic therapy

625
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:42,630
to look for products with money back

626
00:28:47,900 --> 00:28:45,330
guarantees and the jelly bean lady well

627
00:28:49,820 --> 00:28:47,910
she has her own suggestion I think if

628
00:28:51,590 --> 00:28:49,830
you want to try them it may medic

629
00:29:09,209 --> 00:28:51,600
therapy home just grab a fridge magnet

630
00:29:13,839 --> 00:29:11,349
examining the truth in exposing the

631
00:29:15,699 --> 00:29:13,849
frauds but psychics co uk is the website

632
00:29:17,799 --> 00:29:15,709
that critically examines mediums

633
00:29:19,629 --> 00:29:17,809
clairvoyants and psychics follow the

634
00:29:21,699 --> 00:29:19,639
controversies news and discussions in

635
00:29:23,229 --> 00:29:21,709
the lively forum community and now you

636
00:29:24,909 --> 00:29:23,239
can download your weekly fix of

637
00:29:27,279 --> 00:29:24,919
righteous indignation the official

638
00:29:28,539 --> 00:29:27,289
podcast of bad psychics khodet UK that

639
00:29:31,659 --> 00:29:28,549
talks hard and critically about

640
00:29:33,029 --> 00:29:31,669
paranormal bad psychics khodet UK the

641
00:29:44,619 --> 00:29:33,039
UK's largest and most respected

642
00:29:46,359 --> 00:29:44,629
skeptical site looking at psychics it's

643
00:29:48,849 --> 00:29:46,369
a Richard Saunders here with dr. Rachel

644
00:29:51,449 --> 00:29:48,859
Dunlop we're walking down King Street in

645
00:29:54,159 --> 00:29:51,459
Newtown Newtown the suburb in Sydney and

646
00:29:57,729 --> 00:29:54,169
Rachel do we actually ever relax from

647
00:30:00,129 --> 00:29:57,739
this no because we had although can I

648
00:30:01,509 --> 00:30:00,139
just say we just saw a really been roll

649
00:30:03,819 --> 00:30:01,519
down the street though which was quite

650
00:30:05,589 --> 00:30:03,829
amusing it was in the middle of the road

651
00:30:07,149 --> 00:30:05,599
and it's a main road we're stuck behind

652
00:30:09,099 --> 00:30:07,159
the truck and the truck drove off in the

653
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:09,109
bin quality yes very sweet it went

654
00:30:13,959 --> 00:30:10,450
through the intersection and everything

655
00:30:16,060 --> 00:30:13,969
perfect so we just had a nice lunch and

656
00:30:18,279 --> 00:30:16,070
a chat and then we decided to check out

657
00:30:21,009 --> 00:30:18,289
some pharmacies we did we'd and we had a

658
00:30:23,229 --> 00:30:21,019
bit of a win and a massive fail yes we

659
00:30:25,810 --> 00:30:23,239
did well we had a win Richard because we

660
00:30:28,299 --> 00:30:25,820
went into a big pharmacy and it stopped

661
00:30:31,539 --> 00:30:28,309
from floor to ceiling with supplements

662
00:30:32,859 --> 00:30:31,549
and way powders and all kinds of stuff

663
00:30:33,970 --> 00:30:32,869
that from which there's not much

664
00:30:36,039 --> 00:30:33,980
evidence but at least

665
00:30:38,049 --> 00:30:36,049
there's stuff in it you know unlike

666
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:38,059
homeopathy and we asked if they had

667
00:30:41,950 --> 00:30:40,010
homeopathy and she looked at us

668
00:30:43,780 --> 00:30:41,960
physically and said no we don't have it

669
00:30:46,780 --> 00:30:43,790
and we looked at each other and thought

670
00:30:48,820 --> 00:30:46,790
what yeah and she said which product do

671
00:30:52,180 --> 00:30:48,830
you want and we we were a bit shocked we

672
00:30:54,430 --> 00:30:52,190
just said we don't I didn't really know

673
00:30:56,620 --> 00:30:54,440
what to say because I've never had

674
00:30:59,919 --> 00:30:56,630
someone in a pharmacy tell me they don't

675
00:31:01,840 --> 00:30:59,929
have homeopathy so we was thought oh

676
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:01,850
that's all right and we said well that's

677
00:31:06,010 --> 00:31:04,370
good we're glad you don't we went around

678
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:06,020
out of the street walked a couple

679
00:31:10,500 --> 00:31:08,650
hundred meters

680
00:31:13,670 --> 00:31:10,510
as the cars go by we're just stuck into

681
00:31:17,310 --> 00:31:13,680
the street here it might be better oh

682
00:31:21,330 --> 00:31:17,320
this is the street where you work that's

683
00:31:23,910 --> 00:31:21,340
better and so we walk down to another

684
00:31:25,530 --> 00:31:23,920
pharmacy hmm and because you wanted to

685
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:25,540
check out what it said on the packet

686
00:31:29,910 --> 00:31:28,210
packets of homeopathy yeah because we

687
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:29,920
had an email from a listener who said

688
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:32,410
that it says on the side of the boxes

689
00:31:37,350 --> 00:31:34,690
active ingredient and then at least as

690
00:31:40,530 --> 00:31:37,360
lists the ingredients but with their

691
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:40,540
dilutions so essentially that should say

692
00:31:47,820 --> 00:31:43,810
active ingredients none yeah so we just

693
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:47,830
wanted to confirm this so that's right

694
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:49,570
we walked in or just studying the boxes

695
00:31:52,770 --> 00:31:51,370
and the friendly assistant from the

696
00:31:58,200 --> 00:31:52,780
front desk came up and said can I help

697
00:31:59,670 --> 00:31:58,210
you etc etc and then you said we noticed

698
00:32:03,210 --> 00:31:59,680
there's homeopathy their four children

699
00:32:06,450 --> 00:32:03,220
pain and fever and this sort of thing so

700
00:32:08,460 --> 00:32:06,460
we acquired you said to her does this

701
00:32:10,770 --> 00:32:08,470
work do you think of work she said oh

702
00:32:13,260 --> 00:32:10,780
yes it works because our customers keep

703
00:32:14,670 --> 00:32:13,270
coming back and telling us it works so

704
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:14,680
we thought up

705
00:32:19,410 --> 00:32:17,770
it's a bit of a fail then I tried to

706
00:32:23,010 --> 00:32:19,420
explain to her that that's just anecdote

707
00:32:25,260 --> 00:32:23,020
and she and you said you know what

708
00:32:27,630 --> 00:32:25,270
homeopathy is and her answer was I guess

709
00:32:29,130 --> 00:32:27,640
it's all natural and herbs yeah and then

710
00:32:31,050 --> 00:32:29,140
she pointed to the side of the box where

711
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:31,060
it said active ingredients and she said

712
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:34,330
look it says and it said arnica 30 see

713
00:32:40,590 --> 00:32:38,050
this was arnica and not baby stopped and

714
00:32:43,490 --> 00:32:40,600
I said yeah that means it's diluted 10

715
00:32:45,620 --> 00:32:43,500
to the negative 30 times

716
00:32:47,570 --> 00:32:45,630
and she said I'd still there still there

717
00:32:49,250 --> 00:32:47,580
at work they tell me it works they tell

718
00:32:51,170 --> 00:32:49,260
me yeah yeah she hadn't got a clue what

719
00:32:53,750 --> 00:32:51,180
we were talking about and then I said

720
00:32:56,750 --> 00:32:53,760
but you know that people report that the

721
00:32:58,670 --> 00:32:56,760
placebo works too missioner o response

722
00:33:00,980 --> 00:32:58,680
was just priceless this is a woman

723
00:33:03,620 --> 00:33:00,990
working in a pharmacy selling medicine

724
00:33:07,670 --> 00:33:03,630
she said oh I don't know what a placebo

725
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:07,680
is that's above my head yeah fail yeah

726
00:33:11,990 --> 00:33:09,930
you don't even know what the placebo

727
00:33:13,670 --> 00:33:12,000
effect is yeah and when I suggested that

728
00:33:15,740 --> 00:33:13,680
it might be dangerous to give my child

729
00:33:18,500 --> 00:33:15,750
something that has nothing in it instead

730
00:33:20,510 --> 00:33:18,510
of perhaps paracetamol or coding she

731
00:33:23,870 --> 00:33:20,520
said oh no no they say it works they say

732
00:33:25,820 --> 00:33:23,880
it works yeah so so pharmacies of New

733
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:25,830
South Wales what are you doing so and

734
00:33:30,790 --> 00:33:28,290
and I just wanted to point out that when

735
00:33:33,020 --> 00:33:30,800
I worked in a restaurant as a waitress I

736
00:33:34,850 --> 00:33:33,030
had to know everything that was in the

737
00:33:36,620 --> 00:33:34,860
food that I was serving two people I had

738
00:33:38,270 --> 00:33:36,630
to know whether there was nuts in it

739
00:33:41,030 --> 00:33:38,280
whether there was gluten in it where

740
00:33:44,690 --> 00:33:41,040
there was weight in it even just where

741
00:33:46,310 --> 00:33:44,700
the particular ingredients came from so

742
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:46,320
that I could give people an informed

743
00:33:51,290 --> 00:33:48,690
choice when they chose a dish to put in

744
00:33:52,740 --> 00:33:51,300
there now yeah yeah and she and this

745
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:52,750
woman is still a

746
00:33:58,380 --> 00:33:55,450
this water to people with children with

747
00:33:59,910 --> 00:33:58,390
fever fever yeah and saying I don't know

748
00:34:02,790 --> 00:33:59,920
what a placebo is I don't know what you

749
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:02,800
know it works inexcusable so another

750
00:34:07,290 --> 00:34:05,050
tack we seriously have to consider now

751
00:34:09,629 --> 00:34:07,300
is simple consumer affairs these

752
00:34:12,389 --> 00:34:09,639
products claim state quite clearly on

753
00:34:14,580 --> 00:34:12,399
the package contains and they don't they

754
00:34:16,169 --> 00:34:14,590
don't then I can't sell something which

755
00:34:17,970 --> 00:34:16,179
doesn't contain something what Viking

756
00:34:19,619 --> 00:34:17,980
these hold me off of this get away with

757
00:34:21,450 --> 00:34:19,629
it no I couldn't work in a restaurant

758
00:34:24,270 --> 00:34:21,460
and say i'll sell you a dozen oysters

759
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:24,280
and then just take out the shells thank

760
00:34:28,260 --> 00:34:25,810
you dr. Richie another interesting

761
00:34:31,050 --> 00:34:28,270
adventure you're listening to the

762
00:34:33,869 --> 00:34:31,060
skeptic zone I'm Brian Dunning from

763
00:34:36,540 --> 00:34:33,879
sceptile calm when I'm not tuned into

764
00:34:39,330 --> 00:34:36,550
the skeptic zone I'm recording thus kept

765
00:34:41,220 --> 00:34:39,340
I'd podcast doing what I can to further

766
00:34:43,770 --> 00:34:41,230
knowledge by blasting away the

767
00:34:46,590 --> 00:34:43,780
widespread pseudo-sciences that infect

768
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:46,600
popular culture I've also compiled a

769
00:34:52,290 --> 00:34:49,210
40-minute educational video on critical

770
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:52,300
thinking called here be dragons at here

771
00:34:58,680 --> 00:34:56,050
be dragons movie.com I hope you check

772
00:35:05,010 --> 00:34:58,690
those out and I hope you enjoy the

773
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:05,020
skeptic zone now it's time for dr.

774
00:35:16,030 --> 00:35:13,300
hello everyone and welcome to dr. Reggie

775
00:35:17,980 --> 00:35:16,040
reports regular listeners would recall

776
00:35:19,750 --> 00:35:17,990
that I recently attended a conference on

777
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:19,760
the Gold Coast called the International

778
00:35:25,570 --> 00:35:23,330
proteolysis society here I spoke to

779
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:25,580
several scientists one of whom I present

780
00:35:30,580 --> 00:35:28,610
this week dr. Sheena McGowan is a

781
00:35:33,550 --> 00:35:30,590
structural biologist from Monash

782
00:35:35,770 --> 00:35:33,560
University in Melbourne Sheena's primary

783
00:35:37,870 --> 00:35:35,780
area of research is malaria and in

784
00:35:41,109 --> 00:35:37,880
particular designing new drugs to combat

785
00:35:43,150 --> 00:35:41,119
the parasite malaria is a health crisis

786
00:35:45,609 --> 00:35:43,160
in the developing world with statistics

787
00:35:48,580 --> 00:35:45,619
showing that one child dies every 20

788
00:35:52,390 --> 00:35:48,590
seconds from malaria and 500 million new

789
00:35:54,940 --> 00:35:52,400
cases occur every year Sheena also tells

790
00:35:56,230 --> 00:35:54,950
us about a new vaccine for malaria which

791
00:36:00,160 --> 00:35:56,240
is scheduled to be rolled out across

792
00:36:02,650 --> 00:36:00,170
Africa in 2010 something else for the

793
00:36:04,660 --> 00:36:02,660
anti-vaxxers to complain about as you'll

794
00:36:06,850 --> 00:36:04,670
hear in this interview Sheena and her

795
00:36:09,670 --> 00:36:06,860
team are using a unique and elegant way

796
00:36:12,250 --> 00:36:09,680
of targeting the parasite with new drugs

797
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:12,260
and i'm here today with sheena McGowan

798
00:36:17,250 --> 00:36:14,090
hi Sheena how are you good thank you

799
00:36:20,500 --> 00:36:17,260
welcome to the skeptic zone we're in a

800
00:36:22,599 --> 00:36:20,510
rather tropical setting today are we for

801
00:36:24,849 --> 00:36:22,609
the international proteolysis conference

802
00:36:26,950 --> 00:36:24,859
gorgeous City to be open this year and

803
00:36:29,349 --> 00:36:26,960
apparently the pool here is quite famous

804
00:36:30,670 --> 00:36:29,359
but I haven't been down there yet you're

805
00:36:32,410 --> 00:36:30,680
going for a swim laughter this happiness

806
00:36:34,300 --> 00:36:32,420
yeah that's her I intend to go to you

807
00:36:36,340 --> 00:36:34,310
apparently I have a living right foot in

808
00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:36,350
their pool so yeah and you can swim and

809
00:36:41,230 --> 00:36:38,960
look at the fish yeah well let's talk

810
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:41,240
science for a moment before that you're

811
00:36:44,650 --> 00:36:43,010
a structural biologist can you just

812
00:36:46,720 --> 00:36:44,660
explain to our listeners a little bit in

813
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:46,730
brief what is a structural biologist a

814
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:49,090
structural biologist looks at proteins

815
00:36:53,770 --> 00:36:51,410
protein structure so proteins are

816
00:36:56,109 --> 00:36:53,780
enzymes and basically all the working

817
00:36:57,660 --> 00:36:56,119
functions of the body and so what we do

818
00:37:01,260 --> 00:36:57,670
is actually determine the true

819
00:37:03,329 --> 00:37:01,270
structure and shape of proteins and from

820
00:37:06,030 --> 00:37:03,339
that what we do is infer how they work

821
00:37:07,980 --> 00:37:06,040
what function they do and for me

822
00:37:10,289 --> 00:37:07,990
personally I go on then to design drugs

823
00:37:11,730 --> 00:37:10,299
that may stop them from functioning now

824
00:37:14,069 --> 00:37:11,740
you go to be very interesting to optus

825
00:37:15,870 --> 00:37:14,079
earlier today about malaria you're

826
00:37:19,049 --> 00:37:15,880
looking in particular at designing

827
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:19,059
drives yet reacts yell area can you just

828
00:37:23,010 --> 00:37:20,410
give Alice is a little bit of background

829
00:37:24,990 --> 00:37:23,020
about the problem like Maria malaria

830
00:37:26,549 --> 00:37:25,000
remains a global health issue in

831
00:37:28,859 --> 00:37:26,559
Australia we're very lucky at the moment

832
00:37:30,839 --> 00:37:28,869
we don't have malaria but malaria

833
00:37:33,569 --> 00:37:30,849
actually does remain a global health

834
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:33,579
crisis so this statistics actually run

835
00:37:37,170 --> 00:37:35,770
that there's one child dies every 20

836
00:37:39,660 --> 00:37:37,180
seconds from malaria somewhere in the

837
00:37:41,849 --> 00:37:39,670
world but there's 500 million cases

838
00:37:44,370 --> 00:37:41,859
every year and from that two million

839
00:37:45,990 --> 00:37:44,380
people will die from malaria what I find

840
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:46,000
more frightening is it half the world's

841
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:48,130
population live at risk of contracting

842
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:50,410
the disease and so that they're just

843
00:37:55,500 --> 00:37:52,690
huge statistics and then their mortality

844
00:37:57,990 --> 00:37:55,510
statistics it exists and mostly they're

845
00:37:59,490 --> 00:37:58,000
in developing nations but you've got to

846
00:38:01,859 --> 00:37:59,500
factor in as well but in developing

847
00:38:04,980 --> 00:38:01,869
nations malaria someone has malaria and

848
00:38:06,900 --> 00:38:04,990
they also unluckily have HIV or TV they

849
00:38:08,549 --> 00:38:06,910
get even sicker so they have a

850
00:38:11,010 --> 00:38:08,559
synergistic effect between the two

851
00:38:13,079 --> 00:38:11,020
diseases and so you have these huge

852
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:13,089
health issues for countries that really

853
00:38:17,430 --> 00:38:15,609
can't afford to deal with them and then

854
00:38:20,039 --> 00:38:17,440
also these countries have economic

855
00:38:21,809 --> 00:38:20,049
there's an economic cost to malaria

856
00:38:23,370 --> 00:38:21,819
because their population is sick and

857
00:38:24,750 --> 00:38:23,380
they're not going to work and so if

858
00:38:26,910 --> 00:38:24,760
there's statistics at the moment say

859
00:38:28,740 --> 00:38:26,920
that any country that has a high disease

860
00:38:30,450 --> 00:38:28,750
rate of malaria will actually lose

861
00:38:31,829 --> 00:38:30,460
one-point-three percent of their

862
00:38:34,010 --> 00:38:31,839
economic growth simply because of

863
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:34,020
malaria and for a developing country

864
00:38:37,970 --> 00:38:36,090
one-point-three percent

865
00:38:40,550 --> 00:38:37,980
huge amount for economic growth so

866
00:38:41,780 --> 00:38:40,560
controlling malaria although we think it

867
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:41,790
might be something that you know used to

868
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:43,410
exist and we have drugs for it and if

869
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:44,970
you go to Thailand you take drugs for it

870
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:47,370
it's still a major major problem within

871
00:38:50,990 --> 00:38:49,170
the country in the world so so you

872
00:38:53,510 --> 00:38:51,000
mentioned the drugs what is the current

873
00:38:55,430 --> 00:38:53,520
therapies and you also alluded to the

874
00:38:57,170 --> 00:38:55,440
rollout of a malaria vaccine there next

875
00:38:59,120 --> 00:38:57,180
year and you tell us your sighting I

876
00:39:01,040 --> 00:38:59,130
can't give you the exit exact items are

877
00:39:03,350 --> 00:39:01,050
don't remember deze there is a brand new

878
00:39:06,170 --> 00:39:03,360
malaria vaccine it's going to rolled out

879
00:39:07,670 --> 00:39:06,180
in Africa at this stage they believe it

880
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:07,680
will be thirty percent I believe the

881
00:39:11,540 --> 00:39:09,690
numbers of thirty percent effective the

882
00:39:12,740 --> 00:39:11,550
problem with malaria is with drugs or

883
00:39:14,990 --> 00:39:12,750
vaccines and they do believe this

884
00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:15,000
vaccine we rejected is it the parasites

885
00:39:18,620 --> 00:39:16,710
are really claiming they work out a way

886
00:39:20,090 --> 00:39:18,630
to get around all her drugs and so they

887
00:39:22,340 --> 00:39:20,100
think the vaccine might last 18 months

888
00:39:24,350 --> 00:39:22,350
so although it sounds wonderful that

889
00:39:25,790 --> 00:39:24,360
there's a vaccine for most of us who do

890
00:39:27,050 --> 00:39:25,800
the research we realize we're still

891
00:39:30,350 --> 00:39:27,060
going to have to keep coming with new

892
00:39:32,390 --> 00:39:30,360
drugs malaria treatment is a combination

893
00:39:34,190 --> 00:39:32,400
therapy generally depending on where

894
00:39:37,130 --> 00:39:34,200
you've got the malaria located in the

895
00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:37,140
world just how you get treated we had

896
00:39:41,300 --> 00:39:39,090
one drug that used to be the you know

897
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:41,310
the end drug that if you couldn't treat

898
00:39:44,780 --> 00:39:42,570
with anybody else used to go in with

899
00:39:46,220 --> 00:39:44,790
that one I think three months ago they

900
00:39:49,220 --> 00:39:46,230
reported the first resistance to that

901
00:39:51,290 --> 00:39:49,230
drug so the problem with malaria is that

902
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:51,300
it can be treated and it can be cured

903
00:39:56,450 --> 00:39:54,930
for usually you just need constant new

904
00:39:58,010 --> 00:39:56,460
drugs because the parasite just keeps

905
00:40:00,110 --> 00:39:58,020
evolving resistance to everything that

906
00:40:00,970 --> 00:40:00,120
we throw at it and because so many

907
00:40:02,740 --> 00:40:00,980
people

908
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:02,750
there's a lot of drugs floating around

909
00:40:07,630 --> 00:40:05,210
all through the system all the time so

910
00:40:09,490 --> 00:40:07,640
we just need basically like weaponry we

911
00:40:11,620 --> 00:40:09,500
need different treatment options to

912
00:40:12,849 --> 00:40:11,630
combat it and unfortunately for

913
00:40:14,410 --> 00:40:12,859
developing nations they need to be very

914
00:40:16,180 --> 00:40:14,420
cheap and they need to be very effective

915
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:16,190
there's no point building a drug that's

916
00:40:19,090 --> 00:40:17,930
going to be really really costly because

917
00:40:21,220 --> 00:40:19,100
the country is can't afford to buy it

918
00:40:22,660 --> 00:40:21,230
yeah it's fine for turrets you know it's

919
00:40:24,550 --> 00:40:22,670
fine for us if we want to go to time we

920
00:40:25,930 --> 00:40:24,560
can afford to buy it but in Africa or

921
00:40:27,730 --> 00:40:25,940
South East Asia where these problems are

922
00:40:29,740 --> 00:40:27,740
endemic it needs to be really really

923
00:40:32,530 --> 00:40:29,750
cheap and really effective you mentioned

924
00:40:33,849 --> 00:40:32,540
that the parasite is very clever and so

925
00:40:36,460 --> 00:40:33,859
for that reason you're focusing on a

926
00:40:38,890 --> 00:40:36,470
very specific part of its life cycle we

927
00:40:40,870 --> 00:40:38,900
are you're looking at it's some some

928
00:40:42,940 --> 00:40:40,880
food supply and you're targeting an

929
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:42,950
enzyme that allows it to break down

930
00:40:46,870 --> 00:40:44,810
blood you can you tell us a little bit

931
00:40:49,240 --> 00:40:46,880
about that yeah for sure so the idea on

932
00:40:50,530 --> 00:40:49,250
new drugs and this is what everyone

933
00:40:51,910 --> 00:40:50,540
around the world is focusing on the same

934
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:51,920
thing we don't want to just another

935
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:53,810
generation of the same thing that you

936
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:55,130
might have a different chemical added to

937
00:40:59,380 --> 00:40:57,290
it that the malaria the parasites will

938
00:41:00,760 --> 00:40:59,390
develop resistance it quite fast what

939
00:41:03,580 --> 00:41:00,770
we're looking at now is a whole new

940
00:41:05,500 --> 00:41:03,590
target and the idea base basically being

941
00:41:07,150 --> 00:41:05,510
as if we can stop the parasite from

942
00:41:09,190 --> 00:41:07,160
eating and that's what it uses is

943
00:41:12,070 --> 00:41:09,200
hemoglobin to basically eat and that's

944
00:41:13,930 --> 00:41:12,080
its food source will start to death it's

945
00:41:15,910 --> 00:41:13,940
a very simple concept so these two

946
00:41:18,820 --> 00:41:15,920
enzymes that we focus on are the very

947
00:41:20,890 --> 00:41:18,830
final stages of its food cycle as such

948
00:41:22,780 --> 00:41:20,900
it breaks down hemoglobin which is found

949
00:41:24,820 --> 00:41:22,790
in red blood cells through very

950
00:41:26,410 --> 00:41:24,830
complicated process but at the very end

951
00:41:28,090 --> 00:41:26,420
it becomes a very simple process and

952
00:41:29,980 --> 00:41:28,100
there's one step that they have to

953
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:29,990
complete to get what they need at the

954
00:41:33,849 --> 00:41:32,090
end of it and our two enzymes that we're

955
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:33,859
targeting our that very final step and

956
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:35,690
our theory is that if we can just stop

957
00:41:39,310 --> 00:41:38,330
the final step then they're they're a

958
00:41:40,780 --> 00:41:39,320
bit stuck they won't be able to get

959
00:41:42,670 --> 00:41:40,790
their free amino acids they can't build

960
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:42,680
their own proteins and the parasite

961
00:41:47,530 --> 00:41:44,810
and we have some very effective data

962
00:41:49,990 --> 00:41:47,540
from mouse malaria and from my in

963
00:41:52,180 --> 00:41:50,000
culture in vitro culture to say that

964
00:41:53,530 --> 00:41:52,190
this will work very very well so so what

965
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:53,540
you're doing is you're designing a

966
00:41:57,670 --> 00:41:55,970
compound that kind of fits like a key

967
00:41:59,680 --> 00:41:57,680
into the lock into a part of that ended

968
00:42:01,960 --> 00:41:59,690
about you absolutely so the enzymes are

969
00:42:04,330 --> 00:42:01,970
pretty Aizaz so they break down proteins

970
00:42:05,830 --> 00:42:04,340
generally so what we're doing is

971
00:42:07,240 --> 00:42:05,840
essentially putting a compound into the

972
00:42:10,630 --> 00:42:07,250
middle of that crow DA's where it would

973
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:10,640
normally in a normal situation would you

974
00:42:13,510 --> 00:42:11,930
know choose something up or break it

975
00:42:16,450 --> 00:42:13,520
down we're actually going to stop that

976
00:42:17,830 --> 00:42:16,460
radios from working completely and so

977
00:42:20,230 --> 00:42:17,840
what we were doing is inhibiting the

978
00:42:22,210 --> 00:42:20,240
function of that produce and then it's

979
00:42:23,890 --> 00:42:22,220
essentially den the water it can't do

980
00:42:26,350 --> 00:42:23,900
what it's meant to do and it stops the

981
00:42:29,650 --> 00:42:26,360
process of hemoglobin digestion these

982
00:42:31,030 --> 00:42:29,660
methods share is different to how some

983
00:42:32,590 --> 00:42:31,040
drug development processes work by

984
00:42:34,660 --> 00:42:32,600
screening large quantities of say

985
00:42:35,890 --> 00:42:34,670
naturally occurring compounds but the

986
00:42:38,170 --> 00:42:35,900
method you're using is really very

987
00:42:39,790 --> 00:42:38,180
specific isn't it by working out the

988
00:42:41,410 --> 00:42:39,800
shape of this enzyme first and then

989
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:41,420
designing something to fit into it yep

990
00:42:44,890 --> 00:42:43,610
we've been very very lucky I mean from a

991
00:42:46,210 --> 00:42:44,900
drug design point of view everyone would

992
00:42:48,010 --> 00:42:46,220
like to go do what we've done and

993
00:42:49,690 --> 00:42:48,020
sometimes it's not possible so what we

994
00:42:51,790 --> 00:42:49,700
did was go and actually look at the

995
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:51,800
detail the atomic details of the two

996
00:42:55,690 --> 00:42:54,170
enzymes and we can really now tell this

997
00:42:56,860 --> 00:42:55,700
you know when we look at commercial

998
00:42:58,810 --> 00:42:56,870
compounds that are out there we could

999
00:43:01,060 --> 00:42:58,820
say now that won't work because of this

1000
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:01,070
because we have exquisite detail of

1001
00:43:04,900 --> 00:43:03,530
these active sites so now we can

1002
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:04,910
actually go through with the help of

1003
00:43:08,170 --> 00:43:06,530
medicinal chemists and so you know

1004
00:43:10,270 --> 00:43:08,180
pharmaceutical and it's not chemist who

1005
00:43:11,620 --> 00:43:10,280
understand that you know chemicals have

1006
00:43:13,060 --> 00:43:11,630
got to make it through to the human body

1007
00:43:15,370 --> 00:43:13,070
and they've got to be soluble in water

1008
00:43:16,720 --> 00:43:15,380
and then can't be toxic and you know we

1009
00:43:18,550 --> 00:43:16,730
can say that I mole can we have this

1010
00:43:19,750 --> 00:43:18,560
compound here and they can go yes or no

1011
00:43:21,130 --> 00:43:19,760
and they can say well can we add that

1012
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:21,140
there and I will be able to say to them

1013
00:43:25,240 --> 00:43:22,610
you will know you can't because that

1014
00:43:27,190 --> 00:43:25,250
won't fit with the protease so it does

1015
00:43:29,860 --> 00:43:27,200
give us incredible detail to go and

1016
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:29,870
design drugs that will hopefully work so

1017
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:32,450
yeah well you demand that method by

1018
00:43:36,340 --> 00:43:34,610
analyzing the protein by its structure

1019
00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:36,350
so you actually crystallize it do we do

1020
00:43:40,450 --> 00:43:38,570
yes and then how do you go from making

1021
00:43:43,359 --> 00:43:40,460
the crystal of a protein into working

1022
00:43:45,460 --> 00:43:43,369
out how it is structured what we do is

1023
00:43:47,349 --> 00:43:45,470
so we literally you make the protein

1024
00:43:50,079 --> 00:43:47,359
until you perform and you grow crystals

1025
00:43:51,460 --> 00:43:50,089
and that is a process in itself so if

1026
00:43:53,319 --> 00:43:51,470
you're lucky enough to get crystals of a

1027
00:43:55,749 --> 00:43:53,329
protein which we work for this

1028
00:43:56,950 --> 00:43:55,759
particular project what we do is we take

1029
00:43:59,980 --> 00:43:56,960
the crystals to the Australian sin

1030
00:44:02,200 --> 00:43:59,990
contrato and that's a large x-ray being

1031
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:02,210
facility and basically we throw x-ray

1032
00:44:06,460 --> 00:44:04,490
beams at it and the idea being that the

1033
00:44:08,980 --> 00:44:06,470
crystal is solid and the x-ray beams hit

1034
00:44:11,170 --> 00:44:08,990
it and they diffract in a certain

1035
00:44:13,059 --> 00:44:11,180
pattern and the way they differ act the

1036
00:44:14,799 --> 00:44:13,069
way they bounce off the crystal will be

1037
00:44:16,930 --> 00:44:14,809
dependent on what the protein looks like

1038
00:44:18,249 --> 00:44:16,940
in three-dimensional space so we can't

1039
00:44:19,900 --> 00:44:18,259
see the protein of course it's beyond

1040
00:44:21,609 --> 00:44:19,910
what we can see but what we do is take

1041
00:44:23,559 --> 00:44:21,619
the diffraction data from those x-ray

1042
00:44:25,630 --> 00:44:23,569
beans and through mathematical

1043
00:44:27,759 --> 00:44:25,640
calculations and a lot of computational

1044
00:44:29,319 --> 00:44:27,769
power we convert that to what that means

1045
00:44:31,180 --> 00:44:29,329
in terms of three-dimensional space and

1046
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:31,190
that becomes our x-ray crystal structure

1047
00:44:35,230 --> 00:44:33,650
so is that a similar process to so how

1048
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:35,240
the structure of DNA was finally

1049
00:44:38,289 --> 00:44:36,890
anticipated absolutely completely the

1050
00:44:39,940 --> 00:44:38,299
scientists had would know about that

1051
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:39,950
yeah how the Delta Felix was eventually

1052
00:44:43,569 --> 00:44:42,170
yet a lucid and an interesting new the

1053
00:44:46,210 --> 00:44:43,579
first protein I think to be crystallized

1054
00:44:47,620 --> 00:44:46,220
was he an igloo oh so am I glogan was

1055
00:44:49,870 --> 00:44:47,630
one of the first ones ever to be done

1056
00:44:51,849 --> 00:44:49,880
for a protein structure and that's where

1057
00:44:53,499 --> 00:44:51,859
the study of structural biology came

1058
00:44:56,380 --> 00:44:53,509
from was the diffraction data from

1059
00:44:58,089 --> 00:44:56,390
protein crystals and that translation

1060
00:44:59,410 --> 00:44:58,099
and calculation from depression data to

1061
00:45:01,420 --> 00:44:59,420
what it looks like in three-dimensional

1062
00:45:04,089 --> 00:45:01,430
space yeah so this is a really good

1063
00:45:05,620 --> 00:45:04,099
example sharing of how basic science

1064
00:45:08,620 --> 00:45:05,630
that you and I do in the lab every day

1065
00:45:10,180 --> 00:45:08,630
you know which is sometimes people don't

1066
00:45:13,299 --> 00:45:10,190
really understand how this applies to a

1067
00:45:15,249 --> 00:45:13,309
bigger problem and in the developing

1068
00:45:16,569 --> 00:45:15,259
world and also in a tentative sanity but

1069
00:45:17,499 --> 00:45:16,579
in addition I just wanted you to give

1070
00:45:19,029 --> 00:45:17,509
Alice doesn't idea

1071
00:45:20,949 --> 00:45:19,039
how many people are involved in this

1072
00:45:23,620 --> 00:45:20,959
project if I know you have is pretty

1073
00:45:26,229 --> 00:45:23,630
lots of vibrating I do under now I do

1074
00:45:28,029 --> 00:45:26,239
and to be fair projects like mine simply

1075
00:45:30,279 --> 00:45:28,039
can't exist one laboratory these days

1076
00:45:32,079 --> 00:45:30,289
cannot do the science that we need to do

1077
00:45:33,699 --> 00:45:32,089
I mean our understanding has progressed

1078
00:45:35,889 --> 00:45:33,709
so far that you need to bring in people

1079
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:35,899
with every level of expertise so I'm a

1080
00:45:40,059 --> 00:45:37,729
structural biologist so I do x-ray

1081
00:45:41,620 --> 00:45:40,069
crystallography um and we do structural

1082
00:45:43,209 --> 00:45:41,630
biology so we do this kind of

1083
00:45:44,919 --> 00:45:43,219
computational design and things like

1084
00:45:47,589 --> 00:45:44,929
that minus university has a huge

1085
00:45:50,229 --> 00:45:47,599
structural biology unit and that's our

1086
00:45:51,759 --> 00:45:50,239
focus for this project however of course

1087
00:45:54,189 --> 00:45:51,769
it's a malarial project I'm not a

1088
00:45:55,659 --> 00:45:54,199
malarial parasitologist so we have a

1089
00:45:56,889 --> 00:45:55,669
large group in Queensland at the

1090
00:45:59,319 --> 00:45:56,899
queensland institute of medical research

1091
00:46:01,779 --> 00:45:59,329
and that's headed up by dr. Don Garber

1092
00:46:03,729 --> 00:46:01,789
and they've done huge amounts of

1093
00:46:06,249 --> 00:46:03,739
research into this they've done mouse

1094
00:46:08,079 --> 00:46:06,259
murine some studies and malaria so of

1095
00:46:09,789 --> 00:46:08,089
course we can't you know test humans for

1096
00:46:13,299 --> 00:46:09,799
our drugs so we do have to test my eyes

1097
00:46:15,729 --> 00:46:13,309
yeah they've also done in culture all of

1098
00:46:18,339 --> 00:46:15,739
the human parasite cell lines and

1099
00:46:20,499 --> 00:46:18,349
testing so all the parasitology has been

1100
00:46:21,999 --> 00:46:20,509
down here in Queensland the actual

1101
00:46:24,459 --> 00:46:22,009
enzyme itself was identified by

1102
00:46:25,689 --> 00:46:24,469
Professor John Dalton who at the time

1103
00:46:28,629 --> 00:46:25,699
was at the university of technology

1104
00:46:30,669 --> 00:46:28,639
sydney and he and his students and

1105
00:46:32,679 --> 00:46:30,679
postdocs actually identified the

1106
00:46:33,819 --> 00:46:32,689
proteases they worked out how they

1107
00:46:36,219 --> 00:46:33,829
worked they worked out how to purify

1108
00:46:38,049 --> 00:46:36,229
them and make them soluble professor

1109
00:46:39,399 --> 00:46:38,059
Dalton now is at McGill University in

1110
00:46:42,219 --> 00:46:39,409
Canada so we continue to have a great

1111
00:46:43,629 --> 00:46:42,229
collaboration with him over there the

1112
00:46:45,969 --> 00:46:43,639
Australian synket ron has been a huge

1113
00:46:47,889 --> 00:46:45,979
resource for this you can't do a drug

1114
00:46:49,269 --> 00:46:47,899
design without a synchrotron in your

1115
00:46:51,189 --> 00:46:49,279
nation so we used to have to go to

1116
00:46:53,169 --> 00:46:51,199
Chicago before Australia secret ron was

1117
00:46:54,549 --> 00:46:53,179
built now I'm very lucky than 10 minutes

1118
00:46:56,499 --> 00:46:54,559
down the road from there and we have

1119
00:46:57,580 --> 00:46:56,509
allocated time it wouldn't have been

1120
00:46:59,530 --> 00:46:57,590
possible with

1121
00:47:01,750 --> 00:46:59,540
and then the drugs themselves so the

1122
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:01,760
chemistry of what we build it's very

1123
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:02,930
easy for me to look on a cult and

1124
00:47:05,890 --> 00:47:04,370
computer and say I need that and that

1125
00:47:08,500 --> 00:47:05,900
and that you need to find someone to

1126
00:47:10,450 --> 00:47:08,510
make it and so we have groups from

1127
00:47:12,130 --> 00:47:10,460
America and Poland who made all of those

1128
00:47:14,740 --> 00:47:12,140
compounds and of course we have a low

1129
00:47:17,590 --> 00:47:14,750
funding body to pay bills so it's a huge

1130
00:47:19,330 --> 00:47:17,600
collaboration things projects and alone

1131
00:47:21,190 --> 00:47:19,340
and get bigger as I go along too yeah

1132
00:47:22,750 --> 00:47:21,200
well thanks very much for talking to us

1133
00:47:24,370 --> 00:47:22,760
today Sheena and good luck with the rest

1134
00:47:27,250 --> 00:47:24,380
of your work for malaria thanks very

1135
00:47:29,410 --> 00:47:27,260
much for that well there's just another

1136
00:47:31,390 --> 00:47:29,420
example of how basic bench science is

1137
00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:31,400
helping solve a big clinical problem in

1138
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:34,250
the developing world we thank dr. Sheena

1139
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:36,290
McGowan for her time and if you'd like

1140
00:47:43,330 --> 00:47:37,970
to know more about her work and that of

1141
00:47:46,120 --> 00:47:43,340
her team head to ww em on a CD uau and

1142
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:46,130
search for dr. Sheena McGowan or you can

1143
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:47,690
find some more information about her

1144
00:47:52,930 --> 00:47:51,170
work on skeptics book calm and until

1145
00:48:04,730 --> 00:47:52,940
next time this has been dr. Reggie

1146
00:48:10,250 --> 00:48:07,980
hello I'm Tony Pittman the presenter of

1147
00:48:13,170 --> 00:48:10,260
the weekly radio show and podcast

1148
00:48:15,630 --> 00:48:13,180
reality check broadcast from here in

1149
00:48:17,430 --> 00:48:15,640
Melbourne Australia and if you like

1150
00:48:19,500 --> 00:48:17,440
listening to the skeptic zone maybe

1151
00:48:22,859 --> 00:48:19,510
you'd like to check out reality check

1152
00:48:26,309 --> 00:48:22,869
each week we bring you a roundup of LGBT

1153
00:48:29,849 --> 00:48:26,319
news that's news related to lesbian gay

1154
00:48:33,569 --> 00:48:29,859
bisexual and transgender issues plus a

1155
00:48:35,609 --> 00:48:33,579
movie review plus a serious skeptical

1156
00:48:39,720 --> 00:48:35,619
analysis of a topic related to

1157
00:48:41,099 --> 00:48:39,730
pseudoscience or the paranormal so if it

1158
00:48:44,789 --> 00:48:41,109
sounds like it could be right up your

1159
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:44,799
alley visit our website at reality check

1160
00:48:51,510 --> 00:48:48,490
online dot net there you can listen

1161
00:49:12,010 --> 00:48:51,520
online download episodes or subscribe

1162
00:49:17,420 --> 00:49:14,240
thank you for joining me for this

1163
00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:17,430
episode of the skeptic zone well we've

1164
00:49:20,990 --> 00:49:19,410
got another year ahead of us and that's

1165
00:49:24,140 --> 00:49:21,000
going to be leading up to town Australia

1166
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:24,150
of course in November November the 26 to

1167
00:49:29,539 --> 00:49:27,450
the 28 this year lots of details about

1168
00:49:31,519 --> 00:49:29,549
that in the next couple of months I

1169
00:49:35,720 --> 00:49:31,529
think at the Australian skeptics website

1170
00:49:37,849 --> 00:49:35,730
at wwc optics com au and of course the

1171
00:49:44,420 --> 00:49:37,859
james randi educational foundation's

1172
00:49:45,710 --> 00:49:44,430
website at www are indeed o RG so until

1173
00:49:47,870 --> 00:49:45,720
next week and I think we'll have a think

1174
00:49:53,690 --> 00:49:47,880
tank next week this is Richard Saunders

1175
00:49:56,150 --> 00:49:53,700
signing off from Sydney Australia you

1176
00:50:00,769 --> 00:49:56,160
mean listening to the skeptic zone visit

1177
00:50:03,230 --> 00:50:00,779
our website at wwc a petting zoo TV for

1178
00:50:05,540 --> 00:50:03,240
comments contacts and extra video

1179
00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:05,550
reports

1180
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:08,490
was it